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Bob from Webster writes It is a shame that the financers and politicians did not fully analyze CATS business plan before committing funds. These problems could have been worked out or at least addressed months prior to this. Maybe Canada should step up and pay for something? In addition, Bill Johnson should keep his nose out of this. All he does is doom high-profile Rochester projects. High Falls and now the Ferry. Come on - was it just a coincidence that he scheduled his "elective rotator cuff surgery" on the day of the maiden voyage of the ferry he had lobbied/supported for years? This guy has got to go! Bill from Penfield writes I wish that someone would do some real reporting on this subject. What are the issues around taking trucks on the Ferry? What has the hold up been with getting this resolved? Why did the ferry only run 2 times a day and not the three that was promised? I more interested in these facts than the feelings of the people who were not able to make the trip to Toronto. Joolie from Texas writes I am ferry sad my trip got cancelled. JiminAtlanta from Atlanta, GA writes As a former Rochestarian, the ferry service looked very promising, a shining jewel for Rochester. New businesses historically shouldnt expect a profit for one year or more and these clowns are pulling the plug after 3 months? There must be more to it than what they are telling the press. My plans, as well as thousands of others for taking the ferry over to Toronto over the winter are not going to happen now and why? Did the powers that be not research the ferry potential prior to submitting a purchase order to have the ship built? They must have. This docking of the ferry must have been planned, possibly for a buyer somewhere else who is offering more, and has been making promises to CATS prior to having the ship built. There is much, much more to it than they are telling us. JiminAtlanta from Atlanta, GA writes Mayor Johnson knew of the secondary buyer from the start but was not allowed to say anything to the press about it, so he was keeping his distance. Mike from Charleston, SC writes As a former Rochestarian I have been monitoring this situation closely. I predicted that the Fast Ferry would only last one year. Looks like I am going to be right. Another true embarrassment created by Liberal Politicians with unrealistic expectations. Where were all the people who should have been asking the tough questions of this Administration and CATS, like "Show Me The Business Plan" and "How can you possibly justify the revenue numbers you claim" especially from an operation that will most likely run only part-time, a few months of each year because of climate and lake conditions, etc. Unexpected problems? Please!!! Anyone could have had answers to these basic issues before this operation set sail. If this ill-conceived venture was created and run by a Republican City Administration this Leftist News Paper would have been all over this poor business plan model from day one when it was first announced. Turn it into a Gambling Casino. That seems to be NY State and The City Of Rochester’s modern answer to poor fiscal planning and management throughout the State. Bottom Line: You can fool some the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time. Wake up Rochester! Jim from Dearborn, MI writes Hell, it's mostly taxpayer money going down the tubes as with the late unlamented American Classic Voyages--deja vu all over again. Betcha the politicians will be lining up to throw more good money after bad. The old saying about a pleasure boat being a hole in the water into which you toss an unending flow of cash apparently applies to high speed ferry services too. JUDD from GREECE writes Racist Johnson must go. He does nothing for Rochester. He gave up on his school's future. So he's trying to bus his kids to other towns. What kind of mayor is that? Then this Ferry issue. Can he do anything right? Was it because it was not an issue with his people, so who cares? Mark from Irondequoit writes I find it extremely disappointing how our city and state governments focused on providing financial support in terms of taxpayers dollars rather than what was truly needed from our civic leaders: critical political support. Mayor William A. Johnson Jr. and Gov. George Pataki should know up front that issues such as removing the pilot-age fees, customs fees, etc. were extremely necessary to allow CATS to operate at a profitable level. Time and time again our government leaders focus on creating jobs in the public sector, a function which simply is not their responsibility or expertise. Yesterdays dockage of the ferry is a classic example of their ineptitude: to create jobs they throw money at a project rather than focusing on the government needs of the projects business plan and removing whatever significant government barriers exist to eventually torpedo the project. At the end of the day the ferry is docked and almost 200 workers are laid off. Joe from Henrietta writes I agree with Bill from Penfield. There has to be more to this than meets the eye. Every reasonable business plan for a start-up business anticipates that there may be a period of time during the initial implementation when money will be lost. A well capitalized start-up has a plan to cover those losses. Did the people from CATS start this project under capitalized? The issue of US Customs not allowing commercial traffic on the ferry also needs some answers. What were the obstacles to commercial business being on board? Considering the amount of public funds that have been invested in this project, the people have both the right and expectation that answers to these and other questions are forthcoming. not surprised from webster writes i think it is ridiculous that these matters were not thought about and resolved BEFORE we (city of rochester, county of monroe) decided to promote and invest in this venture! Shame on our local government for looking for a quick fix to our sagging economy. Let's spend more good money after bad! bail out sound familiar. Scott from Rochester writes Rochesterian's should be nothing but outraged. What other private business is provided so much free press, advertising, and cash to grow? If only our schools, and community programs were given such an chance, we may have actually seen a positive change take place in our city. Mark from Webster NY writes R-News is reporting that Congresswoman Louise Slaughter secured the rights for the Spirit of Ontario to fly the American flag, which would have saved CATS over $6,000 for piloting fees, yet the TV station is reported that CATS rejected the right to fly the flag. Even the U S Coast Guard was ready to present a flag to the ferry’s owners. Another bad move on the part of CATS was canceling the ferry service without bothering to notify people who already purchased tickets. Some of those customers were from out-of-town. Mayor Bill Johnson, who appeared on WXXI radio Wednesday, was correct when he said this makes Rochester look bad in the eyes of tourists. Amateurs is the word the mayor used to describe CATS’ one day notice that the ferry was dry-docked. Sorry but I don’t believe that CATS executives are being totally honest with local residents. It is my humble opinion that the company is doing everything possible to move out of Rochester to another location where the company believes it can make more money. I also don’t believe that the ferry will be up and running next week, next month, or even next year. RipNRead from Rochester, New York writes Not since Tom Termotto’s art studio has this community been the victim of a scam that is until CATS came along. This company managed to secure millions of American taxpayer dollars for a fast ferry that needed engine repairs just a few days after it went into service. Now, with just a one-day notice, CATS announces it will not operate the ferry unless it gets more concessions. The Canadians were never fully supportive of the fast ferry idea. Look how much it took before Toronto finally gave in and allowed construction of a terminal on their side of the lake. And it still isn’t completed. And how much money did Canada’s taxpayers put in for the ferry? After all wasn’t the purpose of this ferry to improve economic development on both sides of Lake Ontario. Face up to it folks, we got stiffed once again. Just think how much it cost to build the ferry, and how that money could have gone to balance both the city and school district budgets. jacko from rochester writes well well well ,another couple of mill down the drain from loser liberal politicians ,Do you think any of these Morons would put one dime of there own money in this Ponzi scheme ,,Ask Brother weasel to shut his big keg hole and admit defeat .He Actually supported johnson (thats from his own show) for county executive ,what a jerk .If there is a positive that be derived from this disaster it is that this is another nail in the coffin of liberalism .Soon liberals Will no longer have the power to ruin our lives .That will be a happy day , Mike from Atlanta writes Crotch city residents....it's Tommy Termotto all over again! The money that the State lent the Ferry company will be recovered by raising taxes on the Rochester region. But what about all the small business on Lake Avenue,like restaurants, who spent money remodeling for the onslaught of the Canadiens? And what about all the poor people from Toronto who won't be able to come over and visit "beautiful" Rochester taking advantage of the wonders of upstate New York? The solution to all of this: turn the multi-million dollar terminal and $43 million Ferry into a Casino on the Lake. Or else it is doomed to rot like everything else near Lake Ontario(U.S. side). More than likely they will just raise your taxes. mattylo69 from Rochester writes I was apprehended for touching the fence between the dock and the "FERRy" which has been considered national security ever since the completion of the new structure at the "port of Rochester." I was encarcerated immediately for doing nothing. I am related to 50 people in Rochester who know at least 50 people themselves and whatever that equals in the calculator is the amount of people NEVER riding this blasphemous attempt to gain tourism. I am a Dean's list college student and I had to waste my summer earned money on a lawyer because of the Mayor's approved project and hired private security company. STUPID; I hope this project is terminated indefinately...Matt Herb from Charleston, SC writes It's time for a MAJOR Investigation into this whole Scheme. The First Place To Start is: Bill Johnson, Mayor What were you, Mr. Mayor and City Council Members thinking????? Show us, the Taxpayers, The Business Plan that (hopefully) was submitted to you. If so, did You Read It? Lets see if we, the Taxpayers are better at doing 6th grade math than you and Council are. Does anyone really know who CATS is? Who are these people? Something really wrong is going on here!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rename this ship immediately "The Freeze" Brett from Rochester, NY writes It's pretty clear the ferry group was underfinanced. $1.7 million in debt, including some start up costs, shouldn't be enough to sink an operation with a boat many, many times that amount. Clearly they lack the cash flow to have even begun this operation (the boat was packed all last month, and despite that, they are out of cash), their initial leadership was lacking. Customs bureaucracy doesn't help in the least though, from both sides. It seems unfair to have a different set of commercial standards for the ferry vs. those who cross at Niagara Falls. There are a lot of issues here. Some blame falls on gov't bureaucracy, while a good amount falls on CATS too. I don't think the boat is done with, but CATS better plan for another ramp up down the road when they start up, because their brand just took a hit. Grandpa Simpson from rochester(chili) writes Typical negative boneheads on here. Here's hoping it runs again soon. Ridership was not the problem. Who can't understand the company not wanting changes to keep profitable through winter? If they (Cats) are pulling a snow job, they need to be sued and find another established company to run the boat. jenny from greece writes Please try not to blame local DJs like brother wease for the failure of the Ferry .You have to understand that Liberals Have good hearts ,Its there brains that is the problem. I see Alot of people are writing from other parts of the country ,My husband And I are seriously considering heading South Also.We also agree that our taxes will go up to pay for delusional leftist ideas .And I am not sure How we can afford anymore then we are allready paying ,,.Thanks for the chance to speak up ,maybe we can start to make a difference before its too late ,. MaBaker from Macedon,NY writes simply IDIOTS the whole lot of them! Kevin from Rochester writes Where's the money? The Feds, state, and city provided some 35 million dollars for "the Breeze". I smell a foul cheat. eye-told-you-so from Rochester writes More questions raised by this article, but will we get any answers? I quote: "...It is also losing out on a possible $18,000 in daily revenue because U.S. Customs and Border Protection haven't allowed commercial trucks on the ferry..." But the fast-ferry specifications listed to the right of the article state that it can hold a maximum of 10 trucks. What trucker in their right mind would pay $1800 for the privilege of sailing across the lake? Ain't gonna happen, folks. Next: "...'We had 140,000 passengers over 80 days,' he said. 'That's more than we need to cover operating expenses'..." Okay, if that was "more than we need," then what's the problem? Why is the ferry service halted if revenue was adequate to cover the bills? But the biggest question of all: why weren't our leaders asking these questions 2-3 years ago, when all of this was started? Are they really that naive to think you don't have to ask these questions upfront? You know, BEFORE construction of the ship had begun? Just remember this: success has a thousand fathers; failure is always an orphan. If the fast ferry doesn't sail again, will ANY politician in this state ever admit to being its parent? Helen from Ithaca, NY writes We've lived in Ithaca since 1991,but before that lived in Rochester for many years. We loved to visit Toronto, but the road trip on the QEW became too onerous to undertake. There was talk of a ferry for years, and when I heard of the arrival of the "Breeze", I said to my husband: "Toronto, here we come.' Bad weather this summer and family circumstances put our trip off, but I was still planning it. What a disappointment to hear that the ferry has been docked. I sure hope the political powers on both sides of the Lake will work cooperatively, and quickly, to get the ship sailing , so we can visit Rochester and Toronto again. Dan from Toronto writes I think it was a good move for CATS to halt the ferry. They knew that they would take a beating during the winter without truck traffic, so why not park it and wait? Now the ball is in the governments court. neo from brighton writes there goes the name calling .when liberals disagree and are shown that there ideas are failing they lash out like children and call people idiots ,,what a shame that the democratic party has been hijacked by idealouges ,, Skipper from Henrietta writes Bend over Rochester. msclaypool from Rochester writes That Mayor Johnson considered the money to go to the Ferry more important than putting more money into education, that the state thought the same, and so many others - they should hang their heads in shame. For as long as I have lived in Rochester (about 20 years now), this city has their priorities in the wrong place. This city does things so impulsively and that is why Rochester has been listed on a National list as the second most confused city in The United States. This Ferry is just our last example of poor planning, etc. We need better housing, better education, our poor off the streets, medical care for all - Before we need a Ferry. Again, Rochester putting money down the drain. Another poorly thought through idea by our Major - who now wants a new bus station for buses that run 1/2 or 1/3 empty. what say you from gates writes where is the mayor ,why is he hiding from the good people of rochester ,can you say scam artist den-of-thieves from Webter writes And now for the most recent on the Mayor's pet projects. First, High Falls. 24 million dollars and another failing entertainment complex while privately funded areas such as the East End and St. Paul District maintain and/or thrive. The latest? Jillian's couldn't be sold by its parent company in a bankruptcy sale becuase of such woeful undepreformacne and the building's owners have put it upf or sale at a mere 46% loss since what they paid for it in 1999. Nothing like trying to create a market where no one wants it. Next, Pae Tec Park. What was originally a stadium paid 50% or so by public funds is now a 78% supported project and the end result will a second, similarly designed open air stadium, in ROchester, less than one block from the earlier, similar facility. Who si the planning brain behind this move. What a deal at the taxpayers expesne for the Rhinos, on top of their 45 year lease for a dollar per year. Wasn't the Sports Authority removed from overshight here for asking the tough questions? Where have wse seen that before? Oh yeah..... And, lest but not least, some 40+ million dollars on the Fast Ferry that may be dead soon. Funny how the Transit Authority was hung out to dry by the media and the Mayor for its demanding of the finances on this project, then removed as the project was pushed through. End result. 80 days and bsuiness suspended. No warnings. Seemingly no contact with the officials that psued the business. Closed in the middle of the night. Wouldn't it be nice if government officials put as much support behind privately funded projects like a new Wegmans in Henrietta and/or on Elmwood Avenue, or a downtown casino, as they put behind these taxpayer funded fiascos like the Fast Ferry and High Falls which should have been toe tagged years ago and would have been without endless taxpayer subsudies? Well maybe they can all duiscuss it over a drink at Emprie Brewing. By the way, how many hundreds of the thousands of dollars did that cost the taxpayers? den-of-thieves from Webster writes Slaughter says Coast Guard prepared to issue ferry U.S. flag Congresswoman Louise Slaughter said Wednesday that her office received assurance from the United States Coast Guard that it was ready to issue a U.S flag to the fast ferry. In a written statement Slaughter said: “This Morning, my office gained assurance from the U.S. Coast Guard that it was prepared to issue a U.S. flag to the fast ferry today. We have been told, however, that CATS asked the Coast Guard to suspend the inspection process. After months of intense efforts on the part of my office and the Coast Guard, I simply cannot understand why CATS would now tell the Coast Guard it doesn't want to sail under the American flag, which will save them $6,000.00 every day in pilotage fees. Slaughter says the fast ferry holds great promise to revitalize the Port of Rochester and the region and she is fighting to keep the service running. http://www.10nbc.com/index.asp?template=item&story_id=12530#top sebastian from rochester writes is there not a single liberal who will defend johnson in rochester right now ,please.we are going off the cliff with this story , I Told You So from Rochester, NY writes Let’s see, here is a ship that is built in Australia with local tax dollars and not one American was hired to work on the project. This same vessel then has to undergo expensive repairs because some idiot rams it into a dock in New York City. Guess who foots the cost the repairs? Shortly after arriving in Rochester the ferry then needs engine repairs costing millions of dollars. Again, guess who pays for it? Speaking of money, millions of dollars are spent fixing up a new terminal at the Port of Charlotte while across the lake the city of Toronto erects a tent to greet visitors from the Flower City. This incident with the Fast Ferry and CATS only proves the old saying “There is a sucker born every minute” is true when it comes to our elected leaders here in Rochester, New York State, and Washington DC. Thank you Senator Schumer, Congresswoman Slaughter, Mayor Johnson and the rest of you wonderful people who decided to spend our hard-earned tax dollars on this pink elephant. So now that we have a ferry docked in the Port of Charlotte, what do you so-called elective leaders suggest we do with it? We could put it on E-Bay and try to sell it. Better yet who needs a Renaissance Center downtown? Instead we could remove all the deck chairs from the fast ferry and use the space to stage local musicals. As for transportation downtown, just have the ferry go down the Genesee River and stop at Main Street, near the site of the old subway to pick up passengers. On the way back to Charlotte the ferry could drop off MCC students. BrianSteeltown from ROCHESTER writes Whether you agree with Mayor Johnson, or disagree with him, leave THE RACE GAME BEHIND. I am fed up with the absurd amount of Racist comments. Thanks Mayor from Rochester writes This is the same Mayor who is against casino gambling. Yet he's gambled away millions of tax dollars with his hair-brained ideas like High Falls. Thank goodness he isn't running for re-election next year. Let's hope the Democrats find someone who isn't so much in a hurry to spend tax dollars like the current incumbent. Pete from Rochester writes Mr.Johnson, Maybe now is the time to give into the downtown casino idea. No public funds $500M worth of construction and how many created jobs? I don't think there will be any question if this project will be succesful or not. Perhaps this could help out your city school budget dilema too. Didn't Mr. Wilmont say he would throw in your renaisance project too? Rochester it's time to speak up and take action, if not we will be the next Niagra Falls. numberss from Toronto writes Its not the fault of the either City, its the fault of the company, who has had internal problems for the last 6 months, resulting in the change of management recently at the top. Tarquinn from Charlotte, NC writes Wow, is this latest development not "clearly Rochester"? I guess not all CATS have nine lives. Where else can such an ill-conceived idea not only gain the blind support of prominent politicians but also come to fruition without a true demand for the service. It seemed that the ferry operators sought to provide a service and worry about drumming up demand for said service after the fact. Cart before the horse, my friends. You wonder why 20 somethings like myself leave NY? High taxes come to mind. You are laying off teachers in the city but have plenty of money to toss at a floating money pit!? Like Bob said, this is not a failed business, it's a criminal enterprise that pulled one over on the good citizens on Rochester and NY as a whole. Fast Ferry. A Thruway without tolls once it is paid for. Frontier Field. What do these things have in common? If you know, you probably left NY a long time ago. Think about this next time you get your inflated tax bill. Man, Carolina blue never looked so good. Boomer from Scottsville writes What can be said?? The taxpayers have been had!!Lets also keep in mind people that started a business in that area the road construction etc. This really smells of coruption, Eliot Spitzer where are you , this calls for jail time. lol from greece writes i will be laughing myself to sleep tonight knowing i am right about the ferry being a huge failure,that will turn to tears when we get the bill though ,for now let me relish in being correct .i am growing weary of defeating liberlism Capt. Johnson from RMS Titanic writes Capt. Johnson "You feel that bump" Lookout "Nah, I didn't feel anything" Capt. Johnson "carry on!" Brett from Rochester writes As much as people like bashing the concept, I don't think it is at all flawed. 140,000 people in 81 days is well on the way to hitting the 400,000 breakeven point (even with down months). Unfortunately, this company may not have had the money to cover/finance the start up costs from the sounds of things. August was a great success. I rode it, sell outs both ways (all at full price). Even the famed Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday discounts were only taken advantage of by a portion of those riders on all those sellout trips (others booked via phone, or via an agency). It's just very unfortunate CATS didn't have their ducks in a row. I think we'll see this back, I just hope we (by that I mean our local government) get more assurances from CATS and an opportunity to look at their books. This can and will work, with the right operating capital and the removal of bureaucracy. Of course, the sudden shutdown also helped them to leverage political pressure. Myk from Rochester writes Am I the only one who saw the episode of the Simpsons where they came in and spent all their tax money on a monorail? http://www.snpp.com/episodes/9F10.html I've taken 3 business classes in my life and it seems like I know more than the people running the city of rochester? wow. Gilligan from Henrietta writes Just sit right back and you'll hear a tale, a tale of a fateful trip. That started from this tropic port, aboard this tiny ship. The mate was a mighty sailin' man, the skipper brave and sure. Five passengers set sail that day, for a three hour tour, a three hour tour……… The weather started getting rough, the tiny ship was tossed. If not for the courage of the fearless crew, the Minnow would be lost; the Minnow would be lost. The ship took ground on the shore of this uncharted desert isle, with Gilligan, the Skipper too, the Millionaire, and his Wife, the Movie Star, the Professor and Mary Ann, here on Gilligan's Isle. So this is the tale of our castaways, they're here for a long, long time. They'll have to make the best of things, it's an uphill climb. The first mate and his skipper too, will do their very best, to make the others comfortable, in the tropic island nest. No phones, no lights, no motor cars, not a single luxury. Like Robinson Crusoe, it's primitive as can be. So join us here each week my friend, you're sure to get a smile. From seven stranded Castaways, Here on Gilligan's Isle. Brett from Rochester writes Well, it's a little different than that episode, but it is pretty funny. The city and state's only mistake (albeit a big one) was to not get solid access to CATS' books (they played the "private" card). Balony aside, I'm sure one of the main things they are doing right now is searching for investors/capital. Again, if a small $1.7 million debt puts you out of business when you are operating a boat well in excess of $40 million, something is wrong, those should be simple start up costs. You didn't have the cash to begin with. No matter how good a concept is, if you don't have the cash to operate and grow it to profitability, you'll fail. It's a leading cause of failure in business, I hope it won't ultimately be here. MIR from Rochester writes I have grown up in this city and have seen it's severe decline. I have seen businesses leave shops close and the crime rate go up. As a citizen of this community(not for long) I wonder if the leadership of the city needs to be changed. This city has been in decline for the last 10 years and the leader of the city Mayor Johnson hasn't done anything to curb crime or to bring businesses to this once thriving city. As a city employee I have seen this city administration mismanage money in the worst ways. To bring this community back to what it once was the city administration needs to be completely changed so that new ideas will help this struggling community make a come back. den-of-thieves from Webter writes THE BREEZE WEBSITE IS DOWN AND OFFLINE. NEWS 10 REPORTS THAT CATS CLAIMS IT KNEW NOTHING ABOUT IT AND IS WORKIGN TO RECTIFY. HOW CONVENIENT WHENT THAT IS THE PRIMARY WAY, OTHER THEN LEAVING A VOICE MAIL, TO GET A REFUND. IT IS TIME FOR THE STATE ATTORNEY GENERAL TO INVESTIGATE THIS GROWING SCAM! F THE FERRY! den-of-thieves from Webter writes IT IS DEAD..... www.thebreeze.com/ TIMSTM from Rochester writes We knew this from the start, but the Rochester media, including this paper, said we were not being optomistic and should stop asking questions and start forking over more public money for yet another ill-conceived program. Right behind the ferry operators and the politicians on the culpability list is this paper. The First Ammendment gives you the right to question such actions by those in power, and you abdicated the responsibility to your subscribers and advertisers. There has been a tremendous amount of skepticism towards this project from the very beginning. We didn't want it, we didn't need it, and we didn't ask for it; yet now our money is tied up in it. The powers that be in state and local government did not secure adequate contractual assurances from CATS should the service fail, and now we're dead LAST on the list of creditors on this darn albatross, like we thought we'd even get our money's worth out of it anyway. Good riddance! The Hurler from Rochester writes Alright show of hands, who votes for Johnson? tapped out! from Rochester writes Most intelligent people saw this coming. It is just a shame it had to cost so much. We as taxpayers must be allowed to vote on any future venture that includes taxpayer money. TOM from ROCHESTER writes IF CATS GOT RID OFF THE TWO CORPORATE PSYCHOPATHS RUNNING IT BRIAN PRINCE AND DOMINICK DELUCIA,AS NO ONE TRUST THEM.THEY ARE STILL PULLING THE STINGS bell from toronto writes yeh i agree they did a good con job on you all in rochester i think those two guys thought we in toronto would be as thick as the people in new york and throw big bucks at them what money did they put in, was it all a big con.they should be run out off town genesee gal from rochester writes what about that wacky route the Coast Guard imposed on the ferry? Instead of a 55 minute trip across the lake, the ship was ordered to hug the coastline, taking 2 1/2 hours. louise slaughter, chuck schumer and hillary better be jumping all over homeland security to get our ferry back with a bee-line trip and transporting commercial trucks. why are the coast guard and homeland security playing games with our city? genesee gal from rochester writes well you Johnson bashers (and presumably suburban folk), he did a dang good job. your hero jack doyle did more to hurt our city than a romp thru town by godzilla. Willie from Orlando writes It appears I moved just in time. My Rochester summary: horrible winter weather, the worst taxes in the country, one very liberal newspaper, declining employment, incompetent politicians, and ill-advised taxpayer funded projects such as [insert 'Frontier Field','Fast Ferry', 'High Falls' and 'PaeTec Park' here]. My new city has: no state income tax, great weather, outstanding employment opportunities, very low property taxes (about 1/3 of Rocester's taxes), my school district has higher SAT scores, and pretty much unlimited recreational options. So why stay in Rochester? My prediction: the D&C will never uncover the real issues with the Ferry; it will only blame the government for imposing fees and not allowing trucks. The real issue is that this project was a mistake from the beginning; many restaurants fail even though they have many customers every night. The fact that the Ferry had a relatively decent ridership does not negate a bad business model. BTW: I really liked Rochester when I lived there, but a change of scenery will really open one's eyes... Brooks from Rochester writes Whether the Ferry survives or not, one can count on the continued many-decade-long decline of Rochester. It is short-sited to blame Mayor Johnson. He is only the latest and most vocal of our glorious inspired leaders. (I've never laughed so much as when reading the Renaissance Plan 2000, and its hilarious sequel, Renaissance Plan 2010) Rochester has a long tradition of electing idiots to positions of leadership (Democrat and Republican alike). There is no reason to believe this will change anytime in the near future. Last one out, close the door. PRINCETON TOM from THE ABYSS writes Can anybody answer the following questions, who is this Cornel Martin and how much is he getting paid? Also will he still get paid just like every other Company (KODAK) pays there CEO's? Man I feel like I am in those Cities were the Mayors bankrupt the city, have the state bail them out and then do it all over again 20 years later. Bunch of crooks with hidden agendas, this was well planned out to stop service the day before school starts. The bottom line in this is the little man that pays for this, just like the countless projects gone or soon to be gone, reminders thru out Rochester. Hang on boys and girls the ride where on is goingto be a wicked one. graham from rochester writes Princeton Tom,Cornel Martin is just a puppet put up by the two guys calling the shots,to take the flak away from them do not be taken in ,he is just another Howard Thomas they are still in total control they have conned you all in rochester it was all a ruse .There was no real change at the top off cats management. monster from Toronto writes Why should Canada pay into an American capital venture? We are not business partners, we are simply a port of call. We agreed to allow the ship to dock and operate, and that should be the extent of our involvement. Aside from that WE did agree to build a specific use terminal, for which I am thankfull we did not waste our money, considering the venture was unable to sustain itself for more than 3 months. Talk about high speed. Bill from Webster writes Nojay was right all along he never did trust those two guys and their business plan,we should have listen to him.Send in the auditor. Bill from Webster writes Nojay was right all along he never did trust those two guys and their business plan,we should have listen to him.Send in the auditor. Ray from Pittsford writes They should be run out off town. Debbie from Rochester writes I'd like more facts on the ferry too! Where were the lawyers when this was on the table....maritime, international and custom lawyers and what's this about the 'coast guard said' stuff. They don't need things in writting and no one is accountable or responsible? Sounds like more 'free' taxpayer money down the drain and it disqusts me. It's a private business and it's running on federal and state contributions (I think I'm right..please correct me if I'm wrong) and they aren't capable of managing their business. Sounds like it's not even a USA business as they refuse to fly our flag! I think this is a case of give me more money.....I say, let them leave! If we venture into this again let's think of putting people here to work or at least have the darn thing built in the USA! And if the laws are old, make sure they're changed before the thing gets off the drawing board and how about some responsibility and accountability! I'm tired of having my hard earned money thrown away!!! Reg from Minneapolis writes I thought Buffalo was bad for hitching its wagon to Aldelphia. Tom Galisano(sp) may the be smartest man in the region. Why is no one listening to the smart (read: successful) business leaders in the area? LOL from Toronto writes Rochester is such a joke. who wants to go there. The people up here are just now hearing about this ferry, it's over now and no one even knew it was around. Rochester is such a joke, I went there once and was bored out of my mind. Nothing to do in Rochester except watch some very minor league baseball. That city is a big joke BigRon from Fairport writes The "F" Ferry has been a scam from the beginning. CATS was using public money to get the ferry built. Once they had the hardware built, they'd make a lame attempt on the Rochester to Toronto route. Now they're crying the blues to get more taxpayer money before they announce that the ferry has been sold outside the local area. The state attorney general should check this operation out. I would love to be proven wrong and have the ferry service here for the next 20 years.....but I don't think so. Fed Up from Pittsford writes They should rename the ferry The Sucker Of Rochester. Or Johnson's Folly. I want a refund on the taxes I had to shell out for this joke. Docked Ferry from Roch writes Thanks to this Fast Ferry debacle, Rochester is now the butt of jokes in Canada, and the rest of the United States. Our elected leaders, especially the Mayor, who promoted this farce should take full responsibility for spending tax dollars that could have been used to hire school nurses and prevent city and school tax increases. I agree with previous posters that Attorney General Spitzer should call for an investigation into this CATS deal. I smell a rotten fish. Chris from Webster writes Where are the principals from CATS? Dominck DeLucia and Brian Prince. These 2 gentleman are Rochester natives that will not appear before the public and explain why this projct failed. Instead thay send out their puppet Cornell Martin. Ginger from Toronto writes Poor Rochester, always good for a laugh. FROM THE TORONTO GLOBE AND MAIL By KATHERINE HARDING With a report from Jennifer Lewington Thursday, September 9, 2004 - Page A15 ... In Rochester, news that the ferry had quit running disappointed a community that was depending on it to help revive its sagging economy. "The ferry must not sit idle," an editorial in the Democrat and Chronicle newspaper stated. "Too much community spirit and money, public and private, are at stake." Rochester, New York state and the U.S. federal government have collectively pitched in more than $20-million (U.S.). No Canadian governments have directly given money to the ferry operator. MaBaker from Macedon,NY writes hold on there! all you bashing Mayor Johnson. it's not his fault. even if he wasn't %100 behind the ferry from the get go, the funds were made available for the ferry. the mayor has the right to disagree with a project costing US the TAXPAYERS millions of dollars without a single guarentee that it would turn our tourism economy into a boom. maybe Mayor Johnson was looking far ahead than the rest of them ferry investors and politicians aiming for a swift return on their investment. then we have Canada. you all recall how they didn't have have a docking area ready for the ferry but a make shift one? just now they're building it! one has to question if this side of the lake (Rochester) is forcing our Canadian friends into a venture they're not interested in. as the saying goes: think before you leap. now would we fault the Canadians for saying 'why would i wanna go to Rochester' after the latest fiasco? finally, you all thinking docking the ferry is FREE? think again. will be getting the docking bill soon! boy! what a mess! Fast Fairy from Not Rochester writes Hey, Cornel! If this little ferry venture doesn't work out, judging from your management skills, you can always work in Kodak's upper management. I have more faith in the tooth fairy than I do in the fast ferry. "The ferry with attitude, ripping you off at more than 50 miles per hour". I still chuckle when I think of the flash movie on CATS website. Does that site still exist? zubalove from rochester writes I'm surprised by the rush to judgement and the partisan attacks on this board. The commentary is inflamed and not constructive. Additionally, the "I told you so" people are a little premature in their declarations. It seems this was strategic move from CATS to address multiple issues before moving into the "off-season". While pilotage appears to have been about to be solved (which doesn't mean it actually would have been solved), the customs issues and the commercial truck issues still need to be addressed. Not to mention, that this company has been dealing with a less than helpful Toronto government from the start. Businesses have trouble from their inception. Rarely are their not issues with it. Was the company under capitized? No. They had an Eschrow account for the lean season. The fact that they are unable to access it based on the aforementioned factors is a problem. The sudden suspension of service has mobilized the people in power to get this thing fixed. It was an effective, but less than ideal, way for CATS to draw attention to this problem. As for the partisan mudslingers, add up the progress created in this country by liberals versus that from conservatives. Scoreboard. The numbers from August are proof this will succeed. It is a simple matter of getting the principles to do what they said they would. starr from Perry writes The best thing that could have happened was to shut this thing down. Does anyone realize the potential dangers to our country? No metal detectors or x-ray of items or persons in Toronto. Anyone or anything could get into the United States via the ferry. We have to go through the security in Rochester to get on, why not to come home. For the terroists out there, Easy work, get into the Port of Rochester and BOOM!!! The BREEZE, perfect name for them to call it. Keep this thing shut down until the government can get the security fixed. I would rather drive to Canada, the security is more secure on the border. rick14620us from rochester writes Well I am confused! Ok so I am not a business person but I do have to balance my check book and pay my bills. If the Fast Ferry is carrying more that the required number of passengers per day to meet operating expenses then why has it shut down service? Why would the Fast Ferry even consider trucking business in its plan? Most truckers get paid by mileage so why would they take a shortcut (less miles) for the same or even more trip time? How can anyone start a business without understanding the costs involved? It is hard to convince me that the execs of the Fast Ferry did not understand fuel costs, pilotage fees and custom fees as these costs are integral to their business. I have not ridden the Ferry and because the costs far outweigh the gains (in my opinion) I had not planned to ever use it. I do wonder though how you could expect this venture to have long term profitability. The time it takes to arrive at the ferry terminal, park, clear customs, travel across the lake and clear customs there make the time invested at least as much as what it would be to drive from Rochester to Toronto. Add to that the cost if far greater than the gas used for your car I just don't see this working after the novelty trips are done with. Add to this the Rochester winters and I have to assume low ferry usage the Ferry failing was only a matter of time. P.O.'d from Rochester writes Cornel, Delucia, & CATS: You insult the intelligence of the Rochester taxpayer! KAT from Rochester writes Hang on to your hats, folks! Rochester is going to have a casino after all. I predict the Breeze is our future floating crap game. I believe it was in the plan from the git-go! Bob from Webster writes Please send the ferry to Toronto to be docked. We don't need the docking bills here. Thanks. Haha from Glockchester writes P.O.'d from Rochester writes "Cornel, Delucia, & CATS: You insult the intelligence of the Rochester taxpayer!" He mentioned the words "intelligence" and "Rochester taxpayer" in the same sentence. Now there's a first! Paul from Pittsford writes I think the pricipals off cats Dominick Delucia and Brian Prince should be held accountable for their actions they should be run out off town. Jane from Rochester writes Anyone who ever said that starting a new business and making it a success is without setbacks is either a fool or a liar! I am sure that both George Eastman and Chester Carlson encountered numerous setbacks and unexpected expenses as they established their new businesses that shored up our local economy for many decades. And that was in an era of far fewer governmental regulations than we have today. In my opinion the Fast Ferry is a bold and creative venture with the potential for stimulating an even greater flow of tourists and capital through and into our economy. I consider their decision to shut down to avoid greater losses and to work out the roadblocks that are standing in the way of the venture generating a positive cash flow to be an intelligent move. I still believe that the Ferry is a viable enterprise, but unfortunately both the Canadian and US governments have placed unreasonable burdens on its operation. Why should CATS have to pay for customs services any more than airlines, shipping companies or personal autos that carry people across international borders? Even huge cruise ships that carry several thousand people don’t have coast guard boats with machine guns ushering them in and out of port. Why is it necessary here? I hope that we the people can empower our elected officials at all levels to remove the barriers that are preventing our Ferry from serving the public and achieving its (and our area’s) potential for success! Peter from Toronto writes The owners were very secretive, and I never at any time, saw or heard what the business plan was. I remember thinking, "I wonder what happens when summer is over?. Well, the day after Labour Day they closed it down, and you have to think that was in the planning stages for some time before.It did not surprise me that there was millions in taxpayer dollars in this project. One never got the feeling that people on the Canadian side of the border bought into the project, and certainly our governments stayed well away from it when it came to cash incentives. I think this was seen as mostly benefitting Rochester and Canadians could not see much in it for us. I do agree that Rochester, N.Y., never on the must-visit list for Torontonians, will take another negative hit for this fiasco. Brett from Rochester, NY writes I don't think the value proposition is a bad one. All you have to do is listen to the overwhelming majority who rode the thing (minus those stuck in the current mess). Do you save much time? A little on weekdays, probably not a on weekends. Does it beat the heck out of driving the QEW, you bet (watching a movie, accessing your laptop, or reading the news is productive time, driving isn't). Companies, such as Xerox, have offices in Toronto, they were already taking advantage of the service (it's $300 each way to fly, it sure beats that). For people like me, who go to Toronto a couple times per year, I'll suck up the extra cost to avoid the traffic headaches (don't forget what it costs to park in Toronto, which is why I like the walk on option). Plus, if customs ever moved forward, trucking happens every day, that's viable. I think the concept is fine. The current CATS management team may not be, however. They have always been hush over their finances, and we may know why now. They never had the necessary start up capital. That's like Wegman's half building a store and stopping because it's not profitable yet and they are out of cash (which, of course, isn't an issue for them). Tim from rochester writes Prince and Delucia think they are finacial advisers glad they are not looking after my bucks. Tax from Study writes http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/09/news/economy/states_taxes.reut/index.htm NYS #1 in nation for taxes. Are you getting your money's worth? Sue from Penfield writes I feel sorry for the poor staff i am sure some off the moved their families to rochester just to be let down time after time , Brett from Rochester, NY writes As far as mostly benefitting Rochester, I don't buy that. At least through the first almost two months of service, more Canadians used the service than Americans. I have no doubt many were on route someplace else, but even a meal here is some sort of infusion, while Canadians clearly found value in it. Then, since more of the Rochester visitors were infusing money directly into Toronto, the value is definitely there for Toronto. I think they see that now, I was relatively impressed on Torontoians awareness of the service last month. At Casa Loma, I saw 10 people (out of probably 50 or 60 there) back on the return ferry trip. So there are economic consequences for Toronto. I, for one, don't plan on driving to Toronto anytime soon. I would have used the ferry. Judging by the response from government in Toronto, I think they now realize that. Scott from Rochester writes This is a Travesty to say the least. I am trying to stay optimistic that the ferry problems will be resolved. However I am becoming less optimistic now that the website is shut down! Maybe those commemorative passes I purchased before the Fast Ferry started service will be of some collectors value when I'm dead and gone! Ron from Toronto writes It would seem that it was no accident why the Port Authority here dragged their feet in building the new terminal. Realistically, as we all know right from the beginning, while some folks in Rochester were getting extremely excited about this venture, there was hardly a whisper around these parts until it almost started sailing. This was confirmed by friends in the travel industry who were getting very few inquiries about the ferry and who also really couldn't come to grips with how this would significantly increase tourism since it would seem that many of those people using the service had already been regular visitors to Toronto. They would have come here anyway and given the costs, the ferry was only a travel alternative. It was also, over the long run, going to be primarily a one-way operation(Rochester to Toronto)especially during the winter. Given all this and other issues, despite the politicians rhetoric, I believe, unfortunately, that the "Breeze" will be sailing off into the sunset. Bill from Webster writes Mayor Johnson says they are not looking for more money,only last week they were looking for big bucks off tifa get Delucia and Prince to put their own bucks into thier own company i say not the tax payer. Fast Failure from Rochester writes The fees that the company is complaining about are known to all boaters who travel to Canada. They registered the boat in the Bahamas to avoid taxes. Hence they are stuck with the port charges. This was doomed to fail. Instead of putting money to fix the lake like docks that would attract people or the schools that need the money. We gave public money to a project that was not thoroughly analyzed or planed by people who knew nothing about boating between NY and Canada. This project was based on I hopes and maybes not on facts. let it go and the Mayor should give it up and no this not a race thing its a mayor who cant do the job Brenda from Fairport writes I realize that we the taxpayers were deceived with the project and that the business plan was not thought through but the issue is how do we continue to try and stay positive about our area? I wonder how many of the people who are knocking the ferry actually rode on it. I took my first trip on it this past weekend and it was incredible. The ferry ride was wonderful as were the services and the employees on board. I enjoyed my stay in Toronto and met many nice people from the Toronto area onboard who were riding to Rochester to see what we have to offer. While it may not have been planned out the best possible way, let's not get mired down in negativity. Riding back into our port I was so proud of us and the impression we were giving to the Canadians. Let's work on solving the problems and continuing to promote tourism here in our area. John from Rochester writes I hear the ship is off to the med. George W. from Washington, DC writes Signs of hope for Fast Ferry? There's an old saying in Tennessee--- I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee.... That says, fool me once, shame on... shame on you. Fool me... you can't get fooled again. tvwshubby from brighton writes Nobody has looked at the bright side of the ferry. Lake avenue is looking better than it ever has before. Perhaps having a private company run the ferry was a bonehead idea. If you want a successful ferry look at the Staten Island ferry, Brett from Rochester, NY writes Being semi-positive is a great point, and all we can do now. Many opposed this from the beginning, and are seizing this opportunity, as expected. As I've said, clearly CATS messed up and lacked capital, we should have had more access to their financials. That's my main Monday morning QB comment. As far as the Toronto Port Authority, they claim they are moving forward on the port, fast ferry or not. They say they'll have plenty of other uses. Unless the TPA is full of crud (quite possible, they are known for it), they weren't dragging purely on this issue. While I disagree with many of CATS' claims for the shut down, the port in Toronto was the only negative of my ferry trip. It would have been a big issue in February. It would have been an embarassment to the people of Toronto, with people waiting outside to board and for customs. As far as this being a one-way trip, the stats don't support that, plain and simple. We can make empty claims with our crystal balls, but it does little good. I, for one, won't visit Toronto anytime soon in my car. So this wasn't purely a replacement for another form of transportation I would have used. On ridership, this was a success, plain and simple (every weekend had mostly sellouts at full price in August). On ferry management, this obviously failed. As long as ferry investors don't wisk the boat away in a week or two (CATS claims they won't, but I'm not going to fully buy into it, actions speak louder than words), I think a business case has been made for the service. My main concern is that if CATS is truly broke, legal issues could make too much of a mess of things for future, superior ownership. My hope is a new investor will both infuse cash and take over leadership of CATS. Delucia never was an impressive sounding leader from day one, it sounds like his influence remained. Also, some folks are quoted huge figures on wasted money. The Lake Ave./Charlotte improvements were needed anyways, those aren't lost. The terminal (at $14 million I think) is the real risk. David from Miami writes "CATS" didn't have their ducks in a row?" Can you say SCAM. They planned to take the money and run! Where is all they millions they borrowed from the government? I think an investigation is in order. No wonder all the young people leave Rochester. With all the white collar jobs leaving the city, Rochester has become the Buffalo of the 21st Century. Buffalo without the Bills that is. Snow, cold weather, rain, crime, no downtown, dirt not to mention the boringest place on the planet. The armpit of the country. Will the last person to leave Rochester please turn off the lights. Amy from Fairport writes The fast ferry is something that Rochester and Toronto should be proud of. If you have never rode the fast ferry, I really hope that you have the chance to. The ride is so smooth and the people are so freindly. It is worth the money that you are paying for a ticket. It is true that Toronto does not have their act together with their terminal, but they are starting to work on it. Every buisness has their set backs and as proud Rochestarians we should stand behind our leaders who are trying to bring something great to Rochester! Ron from Rochester writes Although it is possible the ferry can not continue to operate until financial burdens are cleared, it was totally unethical and unprofessional for the ferry's management team to halt operations with no notice whatsoever. This action in itself shows there's something fishy going on with the operators (game playing). They could have announced operations would cease on a pre-determined date, unless negotions could untangle the financial woes. Unfortunately, the ferry has stopped now. On a positive note, the benefits of its existence remains; Ontario Beach Park has been beautfiully restored, businesses have freshened up their appearances, Lake Avenue has been rebuilt, and thousands have rediscovered Charlotte. Ferry or no ferry, Charlotte is a wonderful place to go (as is the seldom-mentioned Summerville on the other side of the river). My parents have told me that they took the old ferry years ago, which ceased in 1950. They said that one stopped operations for the same reasons - money. Don't we learn? Finally, about those "FERRY" signs plastered all around the city. Ever since I saw the first one, I have been in disasgreement with them. Instead of "FERRY", it should have been a graphic of a couple of waves and a boat. This alone would have pointed out the direction to head for the beachfront and boating. I do not think the signs should have promoted ONE (1) private business venture - the ferry. The signs should have generically promoted the entire beach area and its business/recreation community. And I still wonder, why did we have to start out with such a hugh, expensive ferry? Perhaps it would have been more economical to purchase four (4) less expensive boats, which could run according to demand. N from Rochester writes I believe the Fast Ferry was and is a political issue. From the very beginning there was no direct information nor did the so-called service personnel have answers to even the basic questions asked. The CATZ organization has also been evasive in their practice and never do you receive answers or will they allow viewing of their financial records. The CEO Martan is elusive and never has the courtesy to respond to the public directly. Once the news of the Breeze being docked was announced, conveniently there website is no longer available for viewing. This appears to be the work of a poorly run venture and I smell corruption in the air. Bill from Charlotte, NY writes ok lets get realthe ferry is here and so is the port we are getting charlotte on the map again, and the toranto people love it here in rochester. the boat will be up and running again very soon and all of you who are making a big joke about this can go straight to &*&^ cats had to do what they did for a reason and the boat and people will be traveling back and forth soon and all you people who hated this all i can say time are changing. if you dont like it move out of rochester. and dont ride on our boat Prof. Electro from Reno, Nevada writes Hurray for Rochester. I am a native whose family had the good sense to escape from there in 1960. The Japanese badly injured Kodak, Xerox lost a bunch and the crime rate is way up. (I still read the news). All cities have problems but Rottenchester (as we the liberated call it). Still smells of corruption and usuery. Super, the Japanese fixed big Yellow and now the Australians have capitalized on Rochester's weak political infrastructure. Now every Rochesterian has the answer. My question is, "Why did you let this happen?" How about suing the Ferry company, selling their assets and using the money to level Dewey Ave? Sure glad I don't live there. Brandon from Columbus writes The only surprising thing about the Ferry's demise is that it took only 3 months for it to happen. Be honest, this was a long-shot gamble at best and it should serve as a lesson for city leaders to not place all their hopes and dreams for an economic revival in a boat. What's next, a Casino? How about a monorail bringing suburbanites down to Midtown Mall? jed from canandaigua writes I am wondering if the creator/entrepeneur of the famed disaster ROSELAND WATERPARK in Canandaigua NY, had his hand in the BREESE fiasco. The taxpayers took a bath on both ill concieved ventures.My advice is for New York State,local municipalities to stay out of any scheme that involves anything to do with water. Why don't they take the BREESE to the ROSELAND WATERPARK and turn it into a floating casino and let the Native Americans run it. That way , both will make a profit. Ron from Rochester writes From the very beginning I wondered why it has to be a FAST ferry, with one destination, Toronto. Today, all we do is rush, rush, rush. And how about it being an excursion ferry, with numerous stops along the shores of Lake Ontario, including Toronto, instead of one stop either direction? There are many beautiful and interesting places along both the American and Canadian shores. Why limit the customer base and business potential? Add more stopovers (Sodus, Point Pleasant, Hamlin Beach, Thousand Islands, Niagra-on-the-Lake, and more). Spread the excitement, and ridership, of a Lake Ontario ferry by increasing the destinations. Ron from Rochester writes Can someone explain to me (and others who might also wonder) why the shut-down ferry is docked in Rochester, rather than being taken back to Cananda, where I believe the owners live? Who owns it, Rochester or Toronto? Thanks. Ron from Rochester writes We'll have to wait and see what happens with the ferry. In the meantime, looking to the future, I'd like to see a trolley running between Charlotte-Summerville-Durand Beach/Park-Sea Breeze. I believe the right-of-way still exists from the former train route. In addition, a connecting line could run up the Genesee River gorge, with Seneca and Maplewood Parks as desinations. As for the ferry, it could become a Casino-On-The-Lake, an idea that I think has been the plan all this time. SueM from Toronto writes I grew up in Rochester. I have been living in Toronto since I was 18. I have been one of the biggest boosetrs of the Ferry since its inception. I still am. The ferry service that used to run between Rochester and Coburg, Ontario (just "down the road" from Toronto)which ended around the outbreak of World War II) was successful and viable. The Breeze can be, too. I have had several round trip rides and expect to have many more in the future.It's a great way to travel; people actually take the time to speak and be human with one another; it cuts down on pollution from cars (every little bit helps)and its just plain fun. Rochester has a lot to offer, as do the Finger Lakes,Canandaigua, etc., and "locals" shouldn't put it down. Think and act positive and do whatever it takes to get the Breeze back up and running. JiminATL from Atlanta, GA writes Keep an eye on it! They're going to be pulling out of port at night and taking the thing to Europe. Poof! Just like David Copperfield! |